[Xmltv-devel] [xmltv-users] "camera" tag in the credits section

[Robert Eden]

Posted to xmltv-devel, this is better suited for this. (please remove -users on replies)

May i suggest to include a "camera" tag inside the "credits" tag? It is
(obviously) intended for camera operators.

Sounds reasonable and harmless, but I doubt they'll be many grabbers populating. it. Would "cameraman" or "cameraop" be a better role?

The second thing I'd like to ask: If I create a grabber for Austria
(afaik there is no such grabber yet), where should i send/put it to get
it reviewed and possibly included in the xmltv project?

First review the terms of use of the data source to make sure it doesn't violate their terms of use.
Second: write it.
Third: post to xmltv-devel for review
If it checks out it it's in!

Robert

[Lukas Rössler]

Post by Robert Eden
Posted to xmltv-devel, this is better suited for this. (please remove -users on replies)

May i suggest to include a "camera" tag inside the "credits" tag? It is
(obviously) intended for camera operators.

Sounds reasonable and harmless, but I doubt they'll be many grabbers populating. it. Would "cameraman" or "cameraop" be a better role?

I really don't care much for the name of the role - even a generic
"role" tag would be nice to have.

Post by Robert Eden

The second thing I'd like to ask: If I create a grabber for Austria
(afaik there is no such grabber yet), where should i send/put it to get
it reviewed and possibly included in the xmltv project?

First review the terms of use of the data source to make sure it doesn't violate their terms of use.
Second: write it.
Third: post to xmltv-devel for review
If it checks out it it's in!
Robert

Hm that's tricky. I saw a user offering program listings in a self
defined XML format in #tcl on quakenet a while ago; the listings are
still updated daily and are downloadable from a Dropbox account:

Stations:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/42983827/TeleGuide/2012-02-12_stations.xml.gz
Programs for the station with ID 1:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/42983827/TeleGuide/2012-02-12_detail_station_1.xml.gz

(Dropbox is a bit buggy and sets an invalid content type header, but
downloading with e.g. wget works fine).

All i did was creating a php script that parses those XMLs and writes an
xmltv compliant XML:

http://tvgrabat.bplaced.net/tv_grab_at.php?help=1

The actual grabber is mostly copied from the tv_grab_cz grabber; it
doesn't do much more than querying the php script and verifying the http
status code.

All in all - I don't know the origin of the data, and cannot verify its
copyright status, so I guess the grabber doesn't qualify for a release..

Lukas

[Robert Eden]

Post by Lukas Rössler

Sounds reasonable and harmless, but I doubt they'll be many grabbers populating. it. Would "cameraman" or "cameraop" be a better role?

I really don't care much for the name of the role - even a generic
"role" tag would be nice to have.

I initially thought role could be set to anything, but the DTD lists specific examples and XMLTV.PM currently checks for them.


... important part about finding the data source ommitted....

Post by Lukas Rössler
Hm that's tricky. I saw a user offering program listings in a self
defined XML format in #tcl on quakenet a while ago; the listings are

Check the XMLTV archives, but I seem to remember Aussie copyright law is very strict and includes "databases" and "facts". That's why it's so
important to know the source and rules. We don't want to violate copyright on the data.

Robert

[Lukas Rössler]

Post by Robert Eden

Post by Lukas Rössler

Sounds reasonable and harmless, but I doubt they'll be many grabbers populating. it. Would "cameraman" or "cameraop" be a better role?

I really don't care much for the name of the role - even a generic
"role" tag would be nice to have.

I initially thought role could be set to anything, but the DTD lists specific examples and XMLTV.PM currently checks for them.
... important part about finding the data source ommitted....

Post by Lukas Rössler
Hm that's tricky. I saw a user offering program listings in a self
defined XML format in #tcl on quakenet a while ago; the listings are

Check the XMLTV archives, but I seem to remember Aussie copyright law is very strict and includes "databases" and "facts". That's why it's so
important to know the source and rules. We don't want to violate copyright on the data.
Robert

I understand that you cannot release a grabber with unknown copyright
status, I'll try to contact the author of the TeleGuide xmls, but even
if i succeed i think the chances are pretty low that we can use the data
- i checked the ToSs of a few websites for Austria, they all state that
automated download/redistribution is prohibited..

Lukas

[Karl Dietz]

Hi Lukas,

with regard to a grabber for Austria...

Post by Lukas Rössler

Post by Robert Eden
... important part about finding the data source ommitted....

Post by Lukas Rössler
Hm that's tricky. I saw a user offering program listings in a self
defined XML format in #tcl on quakenet a while ago; the listings are

Check the XMLTV archives, but I seem to remember Aussie copyright law is very strict and includes "databases" and "facts". That's why it's so
important to know the source and rules. We don't want to violate copyright on the data.

I understand that you cannot release a grabber with unknown copyright
status, I'll try to contact the author of the TeleGuide xmls, but even
if i succeed i think the chances are pretty low that we can use the data
- i checked the ToSs of a few websites for Austria, they all state that
automated download/redistribution is prohibited..

Have you considered to start your own guide service? If you start with
the NonameTV codebase you have ORF, 3sat and the MTV channels already
covered. Simply register at their press services and use the existing
code.

Looking at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Television_in_Austria you have
the commercial ones and the local ones to implement. You'd have to
register with them and write an importer for each format/site. ATV
might be a good starting point as Tele5 (of the same owner) is liberal
with their guide.

But there are some stations that will be hard to get free data for.
e.g. you have to license anything above basic time/title information
from the channels of the MTV, P7S1 and RTL groups. Some stations might
not want their guide data near a recorder while others simply don't
have a machine readable guide.

Regards,
Karl

PS: My development box is at http://xmltv.spaetfruehstuecken.org/xmltv/

[Lukas Rössler]

Thanks a lot for the input, Karl, something like "building my own guide
service" has crossed my mind earlier, but i quickly discarded it because
it seemed much too laborious. Using the NonameTV codebase seems like a
huge step in this direction though. Furthermore I didn't know of the
"press service" possibility - from your experience: can everyone
register to those services? Or do the stations require some kind of
press card for a registration?
Anyway, I'll have a close look into NonameTV tomorrow, maybe i can put
something similar together..

Post by Karl Dietz
Hi Lukas,
with regard to a grabber for Austria...

Post by Lukas Rössler

Post by Robert Eden
... important part about finding the data source ommitted....

Post by Lukas Rössler
Hm that's tricky. I saw a user offering program listings in a self
defined XML format in #tcl on quakenet a while ago; the listings are

Check the XMLTV archives, but I seem to remember Aussie copyright law is very strict and includes "databases" and "facts". That's why it's so
important to know the source and rules. We don't want to violate copyright on the data.

I understand that you cannot release a grabber with unknown copyright
status, I'll try to contact the author of the TeleGuide xmls, but even
if i succeed i think the chances are pretty low that we can use the data
- i checked the ToSs of a few websites for Austria, they all state that
automated download/redistribution is prohibited..

Have you considered to start your own guide service? If you start with
the NonameTV codebase you have ORF, 3sat and the MTV channels already
covered. Simply register at their press services and use the existing
code.
Looking at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Television_in_Austria you have
the commercial ones and the local ones to implement. You'd have to
register with them and write an importer for each format/site. ATV
might be a good starting point as Tele5 (of the same owner) is liberal
with their guide.
But there are some stations that will be hard to get free data for.
e.g. you have to license anything above basic time/title information
from the channels of the MTV, P7S1 and RTL groups. Some stations might
not want their guide data near a recorder while others simply don't
have a machine readable guide.
Regards,
Karl
PS: My development box is at http://xmltv.spaetfruehstuecken.org/xmltv/
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[Karl Dietz]

Post by Lukas Rössler
from your experience: can everyone
register to those services? Or do the stations require some kind of
press card for a registration?

I don't have a press card or epg company myself :)

Just add some nice words about what you want to do and see what happens.
Basically that you want to provide a guide for home made set top boxen.

Btw, I have not yet contacted the stations that license out extended
metadata, but I've been told that some are quite sensible about their
guide.

Regards,
Karl

[Ben Bucksch]

Post by Robert Eden
Aussie copyright law is very strict and includes "databases" and "facts"

I'm sorry, Robert. You just stated your name. However, I copyrighted the
fact that your name is Robert and that you post on this list. You will
be contacted shortly for the pricing.

SCNR